Carter Page's full interview with Jake Tapper

IMPROPRIETY WITH ANY MEETINGS
DURING THE TRUMP CAMPAIGN AND
JOINS ME NOW, FORMER FOREIGN
POLICY ADVISERS TO THE TRUMP
CAMPAIGN, CARTER PAGE.
THANKS SO MUCH FOR JOINING US.
>> THANKS FOR HAVING ME.
>> "THE WASHINGTON POST," AS YOU
KNOW, HAS REPORTED LAST YEAR THE
FBI WENT TO A FISA JUDGE AND
ARGUED SUCCESSFULLY THAT THERE
WAS PROBABLY CAUSE TO BELIEVE
YOU WERE ACTING AS AN AGENT FOR
A FOREIGN GOVERNMENT, SO MY
QUESTION IS WERE YOU?
>> OF COURSE I WASN'T, JAKE.
THIS IS -- IT'S JUST SUCH A JOKE
THAT IT'S BEYOND WORDS, AND
WHAT'S INTERESTING ABOUT IS
MARCH 20th, DIRECTOR COMEY, HE
MADE THE POINT THAT PEOPLE --
PEOPLE CAN LIE TO THE PRESS.
PEOPLE CAN LIE TO THE AMERICAN
PUBLIC ALL THEY WANT IN
POLITICS.
WHAT'S INTERESTING ABOUT LAST
NIGHT'S REPORT IS IF IT'S TRUE,
THERE'S A DIFFERENT STANDARD
WHEN IT COMES TO EVIDENCE IN
COURT, SO ALL OF THE -- ALL OF
THIS FALSE EVIDENCE THAT YOU'VE
BEEN HEARING ABOUT, MYSELF WITH
THE DODGY DOSSIER AND OTHER
FALSE REPORTS GOING BACK THROUGH
MOST OF LAST SUMMER, WELL, THAT
WILL -- THAT WILL HAVE VERY
DIFFERENT IMPLICATIONS SO THIS
IS A REAL GAME-CHANGE FER IT
TURNS OUT TO BE TRUE.
>> WHAT DO YOU MEAN IT'S A
GAME-CHANGER?
HOW IS IT A GAME-CHANGER?
I MEAN, HAT LEAST TWO TIMES WE
KNOW OF THE FBI HAS INVESTIGATED
YOUR LINKS WITH RUSSIANS.
IN 2016 LAST YEAR WHEN THEY WENT
TO THE FISA COURT AND GOT A
COURT ORDER AND RECEIVED
PERMISSION TO MONITOR YOUR
COMMUNICATIONS AND EARLIER AS
YOU KNOW IN 2013 THE FBI
INTERVIEWED YOU, YOU WERE
DEALING WITH A MAN WHO WAS LATER
CHARGED WITH BEING AN
UNREGISTERED AGENT OF A FOREIGN
GOVERNMENT SO THAT WAS 2013.
AT THE TIME DID YOU HAVE ANY
IDEA THAT HE WAS A RUSSIAN SPY.
>> I TALK TO DIPLOMATS ALL THE
TIME, AND BASED IN NEW YORK A
GOOD PORTION OF THE TIME, THE
UNITED NATIONS IS BASED HERE.
YOU'RE ALWAYS MEETING WITH
FOREIGN DIPLOMATS, AND THE
REALITY IS WHENEVER YOU TALK TO
A FOREIGN GOVERNMENT
REPRESENTATIVE, THE ASSUMPTION
IS THAT ON SOME LEVEL IT'S GOING
TO GO BACK TO THE GOVERNMENT IN
QUESTION, SO, AGAIN, I NEVER
GAVE HIM ANY INFORMATION WHICH
IS MATERIAL OR CLASSIFIED OR IN
ANY WAY IMPROV, AND THE
ASSUMPTION IS THAT IT WOULD GO
BACK, SO IT'S QUITE AN
IRRELEVANT QUESTION IN MY VIEW
IN TERMS OF MY INVOLVEMENT.
>> IT'S NOT IRRELEVANT.
I MEAN, THERE IS -- YOU KNOW, IF
YOU MEET THE GERMAN AMBASSADOR
OR THE FRENCH AMBASSADOR, MAYBE
THEY WILL PASS ON THE
INFORMATION, BUT WE'RE TALKING
ABOUT CLANDESTINE SERVICES, AND
HE WAS CHARGED IN THE U.S. WITH
BEING AN UNREGISTERED FOREIGN
AGENT, SO I GUESS MY QUESTION
MORE SPECIFICALLY IS, OKAY, YOU
KNEW THAT HE WAS RUSSIAN, BUT
DID YOU KNOW HE WAS A SPY?
>> I DID NOT KNOW THAT HE WAS A
SPY WHEN I -- WHEN I FIRST MET
HIM, ALTHOUGH EVENTUALLY IT CAME
OUT.
>> DID YOU THINK HE WAS TRYING
TO RECRUIT YOU OR GET
INTELLIGENCE THAT WOULD HAVE
BEEN INAPPROPRIATE FOR YOU TO
HAVE SHARED?
>> HE NEVER MADE ANY INDICATION
THAT HE WAS TRYING TO RECRUIT
ME.
IT WAS ALL JUST A CASUAL
CONVERSATION, EXACTLY WHAT I
TOLD MY STUDENTS AT NEW YORK
UNIVERSITY.
SO -- AND NO OFFER WAS MADE,
AND -- AND THERE WAS NO
NEGOTIATION WHATSOEVER.
I MET AT A CONFERENCE AT ASIA
SOCIETY AND AT SOME POINT LATER
WITHIN A MONTH OR SO I BELIEVE,
IT WAS SEVERAL YEARS AGO, WE HAD
COFFEE ONCE, HAD HAD A SLIGHT
CONVERSATION.
I GAVE HIM A COUPLE OF MY
INFORMATION FROM MY LECTURES,
SOME PUBLIC RESEARCH REPORTS,
AND THAT WAS THE END OF IT.
>> LET'S TALK ABOUT THE
2016-CASE.
THE FBI DIRECTOR HAS SAID THAT
CONVINCING A FISA JUDGE TO
APPROVE SURVEILLANCE ON A U.S.
CITIZEN REQUIRES SO MUCH
EVIDENCE THAT THE COURT FILES
ARE OFTEN THICKER THAN HIS
WRIST.
DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA WHAT MIGHT
HAVE BEEN IN THE FILING LAST
YEAR THAT CONVINCED A JUDGE TO
APPROVE SURVEILLANCE ON YOU BY
THE FBI?
>> WELL, IT'S JUST LIKE
PRESIDENT TRUMP JUST SAID WHEN
HE WAS DISCUSSING THE
ALLEGATIONS ABOUT, YOU KNOW, WHO
KNEW WHAT WITH THE CHEMICAL
WEAPONS.
LET'S NOT JUMP TO ANY
CONCLUSIONS, AND UNTIL THERE'S
FULL EVIDENCE AND A FULL
INVESTIGATION HAS BEEN DONE, WE
JUST DON'T KNOW.
I HAVE THE SAME ATTITUDE ABOUT
THIS.
HOWEVER, IF YOU LOOK BACK AT ALL
THE INFORMATION THAT HAS
DRIBBLED OUT AND FALSE
INFORMATION GOING BACK TO REALLY
THE FIRST MAJOR ONE WAS THE
LETTER FROM SENATOR HARRY REID
TO DIRECTOR COMEY IN LATE AUGUST
OF LAST YEAR, AND IT WAS
CITING -- IT WAS GIVING SOME
INDICATIONS OF THIS FALSE
EVIDENCE WHICH EVENTUALLY KEPT
DRIBBLING OUT, AND WE SAW IT IN
ITS FULL GLORY IN EARLY JANUARY
WITH THE BUZZFEED REPORT.
>> HAVE YOU TALKED TO THE FBI
ABOUT THE RUSSIA INVESTIGATION?
HAVE YOU BEEN INTERVIEWED BY
THEM OR QUESTIONED BY THEM IN
ANY WAY?
>> I TRIED ASKING LISA MONACO AT
A BREAKFAST MEETING IN EARLY
JANUARY ABOUT THE ONGOING
ALLEGATIONS ABOUT FISA WARRANTS
WHICH HAD BEEN COMING OUT ABOUT
ME GOING BACK TO OCTOBER, AND
SHE -- SHE AVOIDED THE QUESTION
COMPLETELY, AND SHE ALSO MADE
THE POINT THAT WE DON'T TALK
ABOUT ANY ONGOING
INVESTIGATIONS, AND I -- YOU
KNOW, AGAIN, I'VE ALWAYS
RESPECTED CONFIDENTIALITY.
I HAVE NOTHING TO SAY ABOUT ANY
ONGOING INVESTIGATIONS THAT MAY
OR MAY NOT BE GOING ON.
>> YOU'RE NOT GOING TO COMMENT,
IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE SAYING?
>> I HAVE NO COMMENT, NO.
>> I MEAN, JUST -- I PREPARED
FOR THIS INTERVIEW AND I READ,
YOU KNOW, A YEAR'S WORTH OF
STUFF BUT, AND UNTIL FEBRUARY
YOU WOULD SAY REPEATEDLY THE FBI
HAD NOT CONTACTED YOU.
YOU STOPPED SAYING THAT IN
MARCH.
IS IT FAIR TO ASSUME FROM THAT
THAT YOU HAVE NOW TALKED TO THE
FBI AND YOU ARE JUST DECLINING
TO COMMENT BECAUSE NOW THE FACTS
HAVE CHANGED?
>> WELL, I HAVE BEEN VERY
FORTHCOMING THAT I WANT TO GET
AS MUCH INFORMATION OUT THERE AS
POSSIBLE, AND THAT HAS STOOD
FROM THE VERY BEGINNING, AND IN
SEVERAL DOCUMENTS WHICH I'VE
SENT TO BOTH HOUSE THE SENATE
COMMITTEES, AND I REALLY LOOK
FORWARD TO HAVING THOSE
DISCUSSIONS AND REALLY
SUPPORTING THIS ONGOING PROCESS
AS IT -- AS IT CONTINUES.
>> SO THERE ARE A FEW QUESTIONS.
YOU TALK ABOUT WANTING TO BE AS
HONEST AND OPEN AS POSSIBLE.
THERE ARE A FEW QUESTIONS THAT
IN THE PAST YOU HAVE DECLINED TO
ANSWER.
SO LET'S GIVE YOU ANOTHER
OPPORTUNITY.
I THINK YOU OWE IT TO THE
AMERICAN PEOPLE AND FRANKLY YOU
OWE IT TO YOURSELF IF YOU'RE
INNOCENT AS YOU SAY YOU ARE.
THE FIRST ONE WORKS BROUGHT YOU
INTO THE TRUMP CAMPAIGN?
>> YOU KNOW, JAKE, EVEN IF YOU
LOOK ON -- MANY SHOWS ON CNN,
THEY ALWAYS HAVE THESE LINE
DIAGRAMS WITH VARIOUS FACES OF
PEOPLE WHO HAVE SUPPORTED THE
TRUMP CAMPAIGN OVER TIME AND
VARIOUS WIRE DIAGRAMS BACK TO
PRESIDENT PUTIN, AND -- AND VERY
OFTEN IT'S, YOU KNOW, BASED ON
THESE FALSE REPORTS.
I DON'T WANT TO MENTION ANY
NAMES BECAUSE THAT'S JUST GOING
TO ADD ONE OTHER SENSELESS DOT
ON THAT DIAGRAM.
>> CARTER, I MEAN, YOU WANT TO
CLEAR THINGS UP.
THERE'S NOTHING WRONG ABOUT
BRINGING A RUSSIA EXPERT ON TO A
CAMPAIGN.
I'M JUST ASKING YOU WHO -- WHO
BROUGHT YOU INTO THE CAMPAIGN.
WAS IT PAUL MANAFORT?
>> IT WAS NOT PAUL MANAFORT.
I'VE NEVER MET PAUL MANAFORT AND
I'VE NEVER SPOKEN WITH HIM.
AGAIN, OUT OF RESPECT TO THEIR
PRIVACY, IF I TOLD YOU A NAME,
JAKE THERE, WOULD BE DOZENS OF
PHONE CALLS ON THAT INDIVIDUAL'S
PHONE WITHIN THE NEXT TEN
MINUTES.
>> IT WAS -- WAS IT SAM
CLOVEIES?
>> I HAVE NO COMMENT.
>> I MEAN, I KNOW YOU WANT TO
GET OUT ALL THIS INFORMATION,
BUT THEN YOU REFUSE TO ANSWER
QUESTIONS.
>> IF IT'S NOT RELEVANT.
>> SOMEONE TRYING TO BRING YOU
INTO THE CAMPAIGN, TRYING TO
FIND OUT WHO IT WAS.
>> IT'S AN IRRELEVANT PERSON.
HE WAS NOT THE FIRST PERSON THAT
BROUGHT ME IN.
I CAN ASSURE YOU OF THAT.
>> AT LEAST WE KNOW IT WAS A
MAN.
YOU TOLD ANDERSON COOPER THAT
WHEN YOU TALKED TO RUSSIAN
AMBASSADOR IS KISLYAK AROUND THE
TIME OF THE REPUBLICAN
CONVENTION, THERE WAS A GROUP, A
BUNCH OF AMBASSADORS AND PEOPLE
FILLED WITH THE TRUMP CAMPAIGN,
YOU SAID YOU SPOKE WITH HIM FOR
FEWER THAN TEN SECONDS.
I GET THAT.
WHEN YOU WENT TO RUSSIA LAST
SUMMER DID YOU EVER TALK TO ANY
RUSSIAN ABOUT THE TRUMP CAMPAIGN
OR THE CLINTON CAMPAIGN OR ABOUT
THE 2016 ELECTION IN GENERAL?
>> NO RUSSIAN OFFICIAL.
I WAS SPEAKING AT A UNIVERSITY,
AND I SPOKE WITH MANY SCHOLARS
AND STUDENTS AND PARENTS THAT
WERE AT THE GRADUATION
CELEBRATING THEIR KIDS'
ACHIEVEMENTS.
OTHER THAN THAT FLOG.
>> I DIDN'T ASK RUSSIAN
OFFICIAL, I ASKED ANY RUSSIAN
BECAUSE RUSSIANS, AS YOU KNOW IN
RUSSIA, PEOPLE ARE AFFILIATED
WITH PRIVATE INDUSTRY BUT THEY
ALSO DO WORK WITH THE
GOVERNMENT, ET CETERA.
>> SURE.
>> BUT YOU DID NOT TALK TO ANY
RUSSIAN AT ALL OTHER THAN
STUDENTS AND PARENTS AND
SCHOLARS ABOUT THE PRESIDENTIAL
ELECTION?
>> I MET A FEW BUSINESS PEOPLE,
BUT NO NEGOTIATIONS ABOUT
ANYTHING IN TERMS OF ANYTHING
RELATED TO THE CAMPAIGN
WHATSOEVER.
>> I'M NOT TALKING ABOUT
NEGOTIATIONS, BUT AS LONG HAS
YOU BRING IT UP, I MEAN, HAVE
YOU EVER CONVEYED TO ANYONE IN
RUSSIA THAT YOU THINK PRESIDENT
TRUMP MIGHT HAVE BEEN MORE
WILLING TO GET RID OF THE
SANCTIONS THAT WERE IMPOSED
AGAINST RUSSIA AFTER THEY
INVADED AND SEIZED CRIMEA WHICH
I KNOW OUR SANCTIONS THAT YOU
OPPOSE AND YOU THINK ARE
INEFFECT SNIFF DID YOU EVER TALK
TO ANYONE THERE MAY BE PRESIDENT
TRUMP IF HE WERE ELECTED,
CANDIDATE TRUMP, WOULD BE
WILLING TO GET RID OF THE
SANCTIONS?
>> NEVER ANY DIRECT
CONVERSATIONS SUCH AS THAT.
>> WHAT DO YOU MEAN DIRECT
CONVERSATIONS?
I DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT MEAN,
DIRECT CONVERSATIONS.
>> I'M JUST SAYING NO -- THAT
WAS NEVER -- THAT WAS NEVER
SAID, NO.
>> YOU NEVER SAID THAT TO
ANYBODY THAT YOU THINK --
THAT -- THAT IF DONALD TRUMP WON
HE MIGHT BE WILLING TO GET RID
OF THE SANCTIONS AGAINST RUSSIA.
>> ONE OF THE MATTERS THE FBI IS
INVESTIGATING WHETHER ANY
ADVISER DISCUSSED THE RELEASED
OF THE HACKED AND PHISHED AND
STOLEN DOCUMENTS FROM THE DNC
AND FROM CLINTON CAMPAIGN
CHAIRMAN JOHN PODESTA.
DID YOU EVER DISCUSS ANY OF
THOSE DOCUMENTS OR THE RELEASE
OF THEM OR THE TIMING OF THEM
WHEN YOU WERE IN RUSSIA, OR WITH
A RUSSIAN?
>> ABSOLUTELY NOT, ABSOLUTELY
NOT.
>> DID YOU EVER.
>> NO ADVANCE WARNING.
I MEAN, PEOPLE MAY HAVE
MENTIONED IT AFTER -- AFTER IT
CAME OUT, BUT -- OR ALLUDED TO
SOME OF THE FINDINGS, BUT NO --
NO DIRECT DISCUSSIONS,
ABSOLUTELY NOT.
>> DURING THE SENATE
INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE HEARING
ON THIS SUBJECT ON RUSSIAN
INVOLVEMENT IN THE U.S.
ELECTION, THE VICE CHAIRMAN MARK
WARNER TALKED ABOUT HOW THERE
WAS A LOT OF INFORMATION IN
WHICH DISINFORMATION ABOUT
HILLARY CLINTON WAS SENT TO
SPECIFIC PRECINCTS AND COUNTIES
IN KEY STATES LIKE PENNSYLVANIA,
WISCONSIN OR MICHIGAN.
IS THAT THE KIND OF INFORMATION,
THE KIND OF KNOWLEDGE ABOUT WHAT
STATES PRESIDENT TRUMP OR THEN
CANDIDATE TRUMP WAS TRYING TO
WIN, DID YOU EVER HAVE ANY
DISCUSSION ABOUT STATE BY STATE
OR COUNTIES OR PRECINCTS WHERE
PRESIDENT TRUMP, DONALD TRUMP,
MIGHT BE ABLE TOLL DO WELL?
>> JAKE, ABSOLUTELY NOT, AND, IF
YOU WANT TO TALK ABOUT
DISINFORMATION, I TUNED IN ON
CNN WHEN THEY HAD THE FIRST
PUBLIC HEARING, AND THEY HAD MY
OLD PROFESSOR FROM GEORGETOWN
WHEN I WAS DOING MASTERS IN
NATIONAL SECURITIES STUDY
PROGRAM, ROY GODSON AND HE KEPT
USING THE TERM SOVIET, SOVIET,
CONSTANTLY, REFERRING TO THE
MODUS OPERANDI THERE.
IT WAS THE EXACT SAME LECTURE I
HEARD WHEN I TOOK HIS COURSE IN
THE SPRING IN 1994-SEMESTER SO
IT'S SIMILARUMP SAID IN THE MEE
THE SECRETARY-GENERAL RIGHT NOW.
THERE NEEDS TO BE A NEW VIEW AND
A NEW -- A NEW STEP FORWARD IN
TERMS OF LOOKING AT NEW
REALITIES, AND THE
SECRETARY-GENERAL REFLECTED THAT
AS WELL, SO I THINK THAT'S
ABSOLUTELY CRITICAL, AND I'M --
I'M OPTIMISTIC THAT AS THESE
CRAZY REPORTS ARE FINALLY PUT TO
REST, THE ABILITY FOR THE
COUNTRIES IN NATO TO WORK
TOGETHER WILL BECOME MUCH
STRONGER.
>> I JUST WANT TO ASK YOU ONE
MORE QUESTION BECAUSE I BLEEDED
INTO MY COLLEAGUE WOLF BLITZER'S
SHOW.
THE U.S. INTELLIGENCE COMMUNITY
SAYS THAT RUSSIA INTERFERED IN
THE U.S. ELECTION, THEY
INTERFERED WITH DISINFORMATION.
THEY INTERFERED WITH STOLEN
INFORMATION.
THE KREMLIN SAYS IT'S NOT TRUE.
THERE'S NO EVIDENCE OF IT.
YOU SEEM TO SIDE WITH THE
KREMLIN.
WHY?
>> JAKE, I HAVE LOOKED IN DETAIL
AS TO WHAT WAS DONE AGAINST ME,
AND I CAN ASSURE YOU ANY
INTERFERENCE, EVEN GOING BACK TO
THE REPORT IN "THE WASHINGTON
POST," IF YOU LOOK AT THE PUBLIC
RELATIONS AND INFORMATION
WARFARE ASPECTS OF WHAT WAS
CONSTANTLY DRIBBLING OUT WITH
THIS FALSE EVIDENCE AGAINST ME,
I WOULD ARGUE THAT THAT'S
ACTUALLY MUCH MORE MATERIAL AND
HAD A MUCH BIGGER IMPACT ON THE
ELECTION.
I HAVE NOT CLOSELY STUDIED THAT
AND I HAVE NO OFFICIAL POSITION
ON THE -- ON THE OTHER DETAILS.
GOING BACK TO THE POINT THAT THE
PRESIDENT MADE, THAT, YOU KNOW,
WE WON'T MAKE ANY -- ANY DIRECT
COMMENT OR CONCLUSION UNTIL FULL
EVIDENCE IS SEEN, AND I -- I'M
NOT PRIVY TO THE FULL CLASSIFIED
DETAILS REGARDING THAT STUDY
WHICH WAS CREATED UNDER THE
OBAMA ADMINISTRATION WHICH
SUPPOSEDLY PUT OUT THIS FISA
WARRANT AGAINST ME.
>> WELL, I MEAN, THAT WAS THE
FBI THAT DID THAT.
IT WASN'T PRESIDENT OBAMA.
IT WAS JAMES COMEY WHO WAS STILL
THE FBI DIRECTOR AND STILL A
FISA COURT WARRANT.
>> ALSO THE DEPARTMENT OF
JUSTICE.
>> THE ARTICLES ABOUT YOU WERE
MORE DEVELOP RANT AND HAD A
BIGGER IMPACT ON THE 2016
ELECTION THAN ALL OF THE
WIKILEAKS DOCUMENTS STOLEN FROM
THE DNC OR JOHN PODESTA OR ANY
OTHER HACKERS THAT -- THAT
RELAYED THAT INFORMATION TO THE
PUBLIC?
YOU THINK WHAT HAPPENED TO YOU
HAD MORE OF AN IMPACT ON THE
ELECTION?
>> LOOK AT WHAT THE FINAL IMPACT
WAS OR IN TERMS OF MATERIALITY
OF INFORMATION.
WHAT DID WE ACTUALLY LEARN FROM
ALL OF THESE WIKILEAKS E-MAIL,
IS THAT THERE'S SOME DISHONEST
THINGS GOING ON IN THE CLINTON
CAMPAIGN.
I THINK MOST PEOPLE WOULD NOT BE
VERY SURPRISED ABOUT THAT.
TO THEN HAVE CANDIDATE TRUMP,
SOMEONE WHO SUPPORTED HIM AND
OTHER PEOPLE WHO HAVE WORKED
WITH HIM IN THE PAST, ALL THESE
CRAZY STORIES ONGOING,
CONTINUING TO DRIBBLE OUT
THROUGH HIS CAMPAIGN, YES, I
HAVE A VERY STRONG PREMONITION,
POLITICAL SCIENTISTS CAN STUDY
THIS SOME DAY, BUT MY STRONG
VIEW IS THAT THAT DEFINITELY HAD
HAD A MUCH BIGGER IMPACT THAN
THESE IMMATERIAL WIKILEAKS WHICH
REALLY DIDN'T PROVE ANY MAJOR
NEW DETAILS OTHER THAN THE FACT
THAT THE CLINTON CAMPAIGN WAS
ACTING DISHONESTLY WHICH I THINK
IF THIS DODGY DOSSIER IS ANY
INDICATION, CERTAINLY THAT IS
HAD A MUCH MORE FIRM INDICATION
OF THAT.
>> CARTER, DO YOU STILL TALK TO
PEOPLE IN THE WHITE HOUSE?
DO YOU STILL HAVE A RELATIONSHIP
WITH PRESIDENT TRUMP AND HIS
TEAM?
>> NOTHING, NOTHING RECENT, NO.
>> NOTHING RECENT.
>> NOTHING.
>> WHEN WAS THE LAST TIME YOU
TALKED TO PRESIDENT TRUMP OR
ANYBODY IN HIS ORBIT?
>> NOTHING SINCE THE BEGINNING
OF THE ADMINISTRATION, SINCE

Carter Page's full interview with Jake Tapper

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