Gov. John Kasich: 'People Need To Have Health Care' | Morning Joe

>>> A BETTER APPROACH TO BEGIN HEARINGS FOCUSED ON THE PROBLEMS
IN THE ACA AND LET'S TRY TO GET BIPARTISAN SUPPORT.
>> THE DOOR TO BIPARTISANSHIP IS OPEN RIGHT NOW.
NOT WITH REPEAL. BUT WITH AN EFFORT TO IMPROVE
THE EXISTING SYSTEM. >> MY GUESS IS WE'RE NOW HEADED
TOWARD NORMAL COMMITTEE ACTIVITY THAT WILL TAKE 60 VOTES ON THE
FLR. >> WE ARE GOING TO BE HERE IN
AUGUST WORKING ON BIPARTISAN EFFORTS SO STAY TUNED.
WE MAY HAVE MORE NEWS FOR YOU LATER ON THAT.
>> SOME SENATORS YESTERDAY CALLING FOR A RETURN TO A
BIPARTISAN APPROACH TO HEALTH CARE.
DEMOCRATIC SENATOR JOE MANCHIN OF WEST VIRGINIA ANNOUNCED HE
WAS ORGANIZING A BIPART SAN MEETING OF FORMER GOVERNOR YOUS
NO SERVING IN THE SENATE. THREE ON THE REPUBLICAN SIDE AND
SIX ON THE DEMOCRATIC CAUCUS. SOUTH DAKOTA REPUBLICAN MIKE
ROUND SAID HE WOULD BE ATTENDING THE MEETING LAST NIGHT.
ANOTHER OF THOSE FORMER GOVERNORS SENATOR LAMAR
ALEXANDER OF TENNESSEE ANNOUNCED THAT HE WILL CONVENE HEARINGS OF
THE SENATE HEALTH COMMITTEE TEE IN SEARCH OF WAYS TO STABILIZE
THE INDIVIDUAL INSURANCE MARKET, A SIGN IT'S MOVING TO REGULAR
ORDER. AND A BIPARTISAN GROUP OF 11
CURRENT GOVERNORS, 5 REPUBLICANS, 5 DEMOCRATS AND 1
INDEPENDENT, SIGNED ON TO A STATEMENT REJECTING EFFORTS TO
END THE LAW WITHOUT A SIMULTANEOUS REPLACEMENT PLAN.
JOINING US NOW, ONE OF THOSE 11 GOVERNORS, REPUBLICAN GOVERNOR
JOHN KASICH OF OHIO. IT'S VERY GOOD TO HAVE YOU ON
THE SHOW TODAY. LOOKING AT WHAT YOU HAVE WRITTEN
IN "NEW YORK TIMES," AND QUITE FRANKLY, LISTENING TO YOU ON THE
CAMPAIGN TRAIL AND IN OTHER INTERVIEWS, IT'S VERY CLEAR WHAT
DRIVES YOU WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT HEALTH CARE.
WHAT IS YOUR BEST GUESS ON WHAT HAS DRIVEN THIS PRESIDENT
THROUGH THE PROCESS? >> OH --
>> SO FAR. >> -- I DON'T THINK HE'S
IDEOLOGICAL ON THIS. HE HAS POLITICAL PEOPLE TO TRY
TO PROBABLY TELL HIM YOU NEED TO DO THIS OR THAT.
BUT I DON'T THINK HE CARES REALLY WHAT THE SOLUTION IS.
I DON'T THINK HE'S EMBEDDED IN AN IDEOLOGICAL PROGRAM HERE.
THE MORE HE'S IDEOLOGICAL THE WORST HE DOES.
HEALTH CARE IS NOT SOMETHING THAT SHOULD BE DRIVEN -- THE
FIRST AND FOREMOST THING ON HEALTH CARE IS PEOPLE NEED TO
HAVE IT. THEY NEED TO BE HEALTHY.
THEY DON'T NEED TO GO BANKRUPT IF THEY GET SICK AN WE KNOW THAT
IF PEOPLE ARE HELL THEY''RE MORE LIKELY TO WORK THAN IF THEY'RE
UNHEALTHY AND MY SENSE IS AT THE END HE'LL SIGN SOMETHING TO
STABILIZE THE MARKETS. SURE THAT WE CAN THEN HEAD TO A
DIRECTION OF WHERE WE CAN DEAL WITH THE PROBLEMS OF RISING
HEALTH CARE, WHICH IS REALLY RELATED TO ONE SIMPLE THING.
THERE IS A NUMBER OF THINGS, BUT ONE SIMPLE THING.
WE PRACTICE QUANTITY AND NOT QUALITY.
IF WE PRACTICE QUALITY AND PAID FOR QUALITY, WE'D BEGIN TO REIN
IN THESE DRIVING HEALTH CARE COSTS ALONG WITH LOOKING AT ALL
THE OTHER ELEMENTS THAT CONTRIBUTE, FOR EXAMPLE, THE
RISING COST OF PHARMACEUTICALS. >> JOHN, WHAT WOULD THE MEDICAID
CUTS DO TO THE STATE OF OHIO AND TO THE STATES OF THE OTHER
GOVERNORS, REPUBLICAN AND DEMOCRAT ALIKE, THAT YOU'VE
SPOKEN WITH OVER THE PAST WEEK? >> JOE, YOU CAN'T CUT ALMOST
$800 BILLION OUT OF MEDICAID AND SAY IT WON'T MATTER.
BUT JOE, I KNOW THAT YOU WOULD LINE UP WITH ME.
I BELIEVE THAT THERE COULD BE AN EFFORT, A BIPARTISAN EFFORT.
I'VE TALKED TO SOME GOVERNORS, I'VE TALKED TO SOME SENATORS,
ABOUT THE IDEA THAT WE LOOK AT MEDICAID, WE LOOK AT MEDICARE
AND WE LOOK AT SOCIAL SECURITY AND WE BEGIN TO CREATE REFORMS
TO GET THESE ENTITLEMENTS. LOOK, JOE, 80% OF OUR DEBT IS
NOW 80% OF GDP. AS THE DEBT RISES, THE ECONOMIC
OPPORTUNITIES BEGIN TO DIMINISH. SO I THINK THERE ARE WAYS TO TO
REFORM THESE ENTITLEMENTS THAT THE AMERICAN PEOPLE WOULD AGREE
TO, BUT YOU HAVE TO DO IT WITH DEMOCRATS.
YOU CAN'T JUST SLAM THIS STUFF THROUGH -- WELL, YOU WOULDN'T
GET IT THROUGH. SO THERE'S INTEREST IN THIS.
>> WELL, YOU KNOW, JOHN, ALSO, AND YOU'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT
THIS FOR DECADES. I'VE NOW BEEN TALKING ABOUT IT
FOR DECADES. WE HAVE TO REFORM THE
ENTITLEMENTS -- >> YEAH.
>> -- IN THE UNITED STATES. IT IS GOING TO BANKRUPT THIS
COUNTRY. BUT WHAT MESSAGE DOES IT SEND TO
AMERICANS THAT THE ONLY ENTITLEMENT SYSTEM THAT WE
ACTUALLY LOOK AT ARE FOR THE POOREST AND THE TRULY
DISADVANTAGED AMONG US? DON'T WE HAVE TO, LIKE YOU SAID,
IF WE'RE GOING TO LOOK AT MEDICAID REFORM AND CUTS, WE'RE
ALSO GOING TO HAVE TO LOOK AT MEDICARE AND SOCIAL SECURITY AT
THE SAME TIME. >> AND I DON'T -- I THINK, JOE,
LOOK, WE WERE ABLE TO REDUCE THE GROWTH OF MEDICAID IN OHIO FROM
9% TO 3%, AND WE DIDN'T BASICALLY DO IT BY CUTTING.
WE REFORMED. WE LET MOM AND DAD STAY IN THEIR
OWN HOME RATHER THAN BEING PUSHED IN A MORE EXPENSIVE
NURSING HOME IF THEY WERE ABLE TO STAY IN THEIR OWN HOME.
WE DROVE MORE COMPETITION AMONG THE MEDICAID PROVIDERS.
LOOK, WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT SOCIAL SECURITY, FOR EXAMPLE,
THE DEFAULT OPTION COULD BE SOMETHING ALONG THE LINES OF
MANAGED CARE RATHER THAN FEE FOR SERVICE, WHICH IS MORE
EXPENSIVE. ON SOCIAL SECURITY, YOU START
THE BABY BOOMERS AT A SLIGHTLY LOWER LEVEL AND YOU BEGIN TO
INDEX FOR WAGES, RATHER THAN WAGES AND PRICES.
THAT'S NOT LIKE SOME UNBELIEVABLE HARD THING.
AND THIS IS SOMETHING THAT I THINK THE PEOPLE WOULD -- IF WE
COULD EXPLAIN IT TO THEM, THAT AS THE DEBT IN AMERICA RISES AND
IS A HIGHERR AND HIGHER PERCENTAGE OF OUR GROSS DOMESTIC
PRODUCT, IN OTHER WORDS, AS THE DEBT IS GOBBLING UP MORE AND
MORE OF OUR ECONOMY, THEN YOU DON'T GET ECONOMIC GROWTH.
PEOPLE WANT TO GROW. THEY WANT THEIR KIDS TO HAVE
JOBS. THIS IS NOT THAT COMPLICATED.
BUT IT'S COMPLICATED BY POLITICS INSIDE THE PARTIES AND BETWEEN
THE PARTIES. >> GOVERNOR, IT'S SAM STEIN
HERE. WHEN MITCH McCONNELL IS TRYING
TO PUT TOGETHER THE SECOND ITERATION OF HIS HEALTH CARE
BILL, HE PUT OUT A PACKAGE OF ABOUT $45 BILLION IN OPIOID
RECOVERY RELIEF AND RESEARCH FUNDING.
THAT WAS DESIGNED TO WOO RECALCITRANT REPUBLICANS TO THE
BILL. I'M WONDERING NOW THAT THAT BILL
IS LIKELY SHOVED, DO YOU THINK HE SHOULD SPEND THAT $45 BILLION
ANYWAY? >> I THINK YOU NEED TO HAVE A
COMPREHENSIVE PROGRAM. LOOK, I MEAN RIGHT NOW WE
HAVE -- WE SPEND ALMOST A BILLION DOLLARS A YEAR FIGHTING
OPIATES. THAT'S WHY I FOUGHT SO HARD FOR
MEDICAID EXPANSION. AND THIS IS A COMPLICATED
CONVERSATION, BUT THE FACT IS I DON'T WANT MEDICAID EXPANSION
JUST TO BE YANKED AWAY. IT CAN BE -- WE CAN DEAL WITH
THAT IN A REFORM METHOD A LITTLE BIT FARTHER DOWN THE ROAD AS
LONG AS WE GIVE GOVERNORS FLEXIBILITY.
NO, I DON'T THINK YOU OUGHT TO START THROWING MORE MONEY.
WITH THE PROGRAM THAT'S IN PLACE NOW, WE FEEL WE'RE IN A POSITION
WHERE WE CAN MANAGE IT. >> GOVERNOR, MORE BROADLY THAN
HEALTH CARE, IF YOU WERE WRITING A HISTORY BOOK ABOUT THE TRUMP
ADMINISTRATION, WHAT WOULD YOU SAY WOULD BE KIND OF THE FIRST
COUPLE PARAGRAPHS OF THE FIRST SIX MONTHS?
>> WELL, I DON'T WRITE THE KIND OF BEST SELLERS THAT YOU RIGHT,
HALPERIN. I BELIEVE THAT DONALD TRUMP DOES
BEST WHEN HE GOES TO HIS POPULIST INSTINCTS RATHER THAN
AN IDEOLOGICAL APPROACH. THAT TO ME IS WHAT MAKES THE
MOST AMOUNT OF SENSE. ALL THIS STUFF IS LIKE
REPUBLICANS LOSE. YOU KNOW WHAT, ISN'T IT A GREAT
THING THAT REPUBLICANS LOOKED OVER THE CLIFF AND SAW THAT
THERE WERE A LOT OF PEOPLE THAT WERE GOING TO BE HURT AND THEY
PULLED BACK AND SAID LET'S DO THIS IN A MORE REASONABLE,
RATIONALE WAY, BECAUSE NO ONE IN AMERICA DOESN'T THINK THOSE
EXCHANGES NEED TO BE FIXED. YOU KNOW, INSTEAD OF ALL THIS HE
WON, SHE LOST, THIS, THIS, IT'S ALL NONSENSE.
KNOCK IT OFF. GET THIS COUNTRY ON THE RIGHT
TRACK BEFORE WE END UP HURTING MANY, MANY PEOPLE IN THIS
COUNTRY, BECAUSE WE CAN'T FIX ANYTHING IN WASHINGTON.
>> HEY, GOVERNOR, LET'S SWING BACK TO YOUR POPULIST INSTINCTS
THAT YOU JUST REFERENCED. YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT THE
PHARMACEUTICAL COMPANIES A COUPLE OF MINUTES AGO.
IN 2008 AND 2009 THE ECONOMY COLLAPSES, CONGRESS GETS TO
WORK, THEY PASS THE DODD-FRANK BILL, THEY CRACK DOWN ON THE BIG
BANKS AND EVERYBODY IS SORT OF RELATIVELY HAPPY.
THE PHARMACEUTICAL COMPANIES AND THE INSURANCE CONGLOMERATES IN
THIS COUNTRY RULE MORE PEOPLE'S LIVES EQUALLY, I THINK, AS MUCH
AS THE BIG BANKS. HOW COME NOTHING IS EVER DONE TO
MAKE SURE WE DON'T HAVE TO PAY $600 FOR A PILL AND $8,000 FOR
AN INSURANCE POLICY? >> WELL, I THINK THEY'RE
POWERFUL, NUMBER ONE. NUMBER TWO, WE ALL KNOW THAT WE
WANT THE DEVELOPMENT OF PHARMACEUTICALS, WE WANT THE
RESEARCH AND DEVELOPMENT. BUT THERE WAS A DISTURBING
ARTICLE IN "THE NEW YORK TIMES" THE OTHER DAY THAT SAID THAT
PHARMACEUTICAL COMPANIES ARE SENDING MORE MONEY ON STOCK
BUY-BACKS THAN THEY ARE ON R & D, AT LEAST SOME OF THE
COMPANIES. THAT'S WHAT WE'RE SEEING IN THE
COUNTRY, MORE AND MORE COMPANIES INSTEAD OF INVESTING TO CREATE
HIGHER PRODUCTIVITY, THEY'RE DOING THIS THING, THIS STOCK
BUY-BACKS WHICH GIVES YOU A LITTLE SUGAR UP FRONT BECAUSE
YOU MAKE YOUR STOCK PRICE GO UP. I MEAN AT THE END WE NEED TO
MAKE SURE THAT I AS A GOVERNOR HAVE MORE LEVERAGE TO NEGOTIATE
LOWER PRICES, AND WE NEED MORE COMPETITION IN THE
PHARMACEUTICAL INDUSTRY. AS TO WHY THEY DON'T DO IT IN
WASHINGTON, IT SEEMS AS THOUGH THEY HAVE A LOT OF INFLUENCE ON
BOTH PARTIES. WE DON'T WANT TO KILL THEM,
OBVIOUSLY. WE WANT THOSE DRUGS TO BE
DEVELOPED. BUT WE NEED TO BRING ABOUT A
SYSTEM THAT'S FAR MORE COMPETITIVE THAN WHAT WE SEE.
>> WELL, AND YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT A COMPETITIVE SYSTEM,
TALKING ABOUT HAVING MORE FREE MARKET FORCES IN THAT SYSTEM.
YOU SAID EARLIER WE NEED TO ACTUALLY REWARD QUALITY AND NOT
QUANTITY. >> YEAH.
>> I'VE GOT A PERSONAL EXPERIENCE FROM A HOSPITAL IN
YOUR STATE, THE CLEVELAND CLINIC.
I HAD A TERRIBLE BACK INJURY, HAD BACK SURGERY, AND WHEN MY
BACK WENT OUT, I DIDN'T WALK FOR FOUR OR FIVE MONTHS BACK IN
2004. AND I WAS IN CLEVELAND WHEN I
HAD MY PROBLEMS. THEY TOOK ME TO THE CLEVELAND
CLINIC. THEY SAID WE'VE GOT THE GREATEST
SPINE SURGEON IN AMERICA HERE, YOU'RE GOING TO LOVE HIM.
HE COMES IN AND LOOKS AT ME AND SAYS YOU'RE GOING TO HATE ME.
BUT YOU KNOW, YOU'RE GOING TO DO WHAT DOGS DO WHEN THEY GET HURT.
YOU'RE GOING TO GO IN THE CORNER, YOU'RE GOING TO STAY
THERE. I'M NOT GOING TO OPERATE ON YOU
NOW BECAUSE YOU'VE ALREADY HAD ONE OPERATION AND YOU'LL HAVE
FOUR MORE UNTIL THE TIME YOU'RE 60.
SO YOU'RE GOING TO DO NOTHING. AND I SAT THERE GOING THIS IS
THE BEST SPINE SURGEON? BUT HE KNEW THE OUTCOME WOULD BE
BETTER FOR ME. I DON'T HAVE THOSE PROBLEMS NOW
AND HE IS EXACTLY RIGHT.
I'VE TALKED TO OTHER DOCTORS SINCE.
IF HE'D HAD THE OPERATIPERATION, I WOULD HAVE HAD THREE OR FOUR
FUSIONS AND IT WOULD HAVE GONE BADLY.
ALL THE OTHER DOCTORS I TALKED TO AT THE TIME WANTED ME TO HAVE
SURGERY BECAUSE THAT'S HOW THEY GOT PAID.
THAT'S HOW THEY GOT THEIR FEES. >> I WAS AT THE CLEVELAND CLINIC
YESTERDAY, BELIEVE IT OR NOT, AND THERE WERE PEOPLE THAT CAME
FROM OVERSEAS TO TAKE A LOOK AT WHAT THE CLINIC DOES.
IT'S A REMARKABLE PLACE. IT'S PATIENT-CENTERED HEALTH
CARE. NUMBER TWO, IT'S QUALITY, IT'S
NOT QUANTITY. INTERESTINGLY ENOUGH, THE
DOCTORS I'M SURE ARE HIGHLY COMPENSATED, BUT THEY DON'T GET
PAID FOR MORE PROCEDURES. THE INCENTIVES ARE TAKING CARE
OF THE PATIENT AND THE FACT IS AT THE CLINIC IT'S ALL ABOUT
QUALITY, IT'S NOT ABOUT QUANTITY.
THAT'S WHY PEOPLE OVER THE WORLD GO TO THE CLEVELAND CLINIC.
SO THIS WHOLE HEALTH CARE SYSTEM NEEDS TO BE REFORMED BECAUSE AS
IT COSTS MORE AND MORE, YOU KNOW WHAT HAPPENS?
PEOPLE GET RATIONED. WE SEE RATIONING ALREADY AND
THOSE WHO ARE THE WEAKEST GET THE MOST AMOUNT OF RATIONS.
THAT'S NOT ACCEPTABLE IN OUR COUNTRY.
WE CAN DO ALL THIS, FOLKS, IF WE JUST KNOCK OFF THE EGO AND ALL
THE POLITICS. WE CAN FIX THESE THINGS.
I KNOW IT. GOD BLESS.
>> I AGREE. I LOVE HIS HOPE.
JOHN KASICH, THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
AND JOE, THE PRESIDENT'S LATEST TWEET MOMENTS AGO.
THE REPUBLICANS NEVER DISCUSS HOW GOOD THEIR HEALTH CARE BILL
IS AND IT WILL GET EVEN BETTER AT LUNCHTIME.
THE DEMS SCREAM DEATH AS OCARE DIES.
YOUR THOUGHTS? FINAL THOUGHTS?
>> I MEAN HOW DO YOU -- HOW DO YOU REALLYY IMPROVE UPON WHAT TE
PRESIDENT SAID -- >> IT WAS SO GOOD WHEN KASICH
WAS SO HOPEFUL. >> SO THE PRESIDENT IS GOING TO
COME TO US AND THEY'RE GOING TO MAKE MEMORIES THAT LAST A
LUNCHTIME BECAUSE THAT'S ABOUT THE LENGTH OF HIS ATTENTION SPAN
WHEN IT COMES TO PUSHING THIS REPUBLICAN HEALTH CARE BILL.
NOW LISTEN, THE REPUBLICANS HAVE A VERY DIFFICULT JOB AHEAD OF
THEM BECAUSE THEY HAVE A PRESIDENT THAT IS NOT
CONSISTENT, SO IT IS GOING TO BE UP TO THE SENATE TO FIGURE OUT
HOW TO MOVE FORWARD. THE HOUSE WILL HAVE TO FIGURE
OUT HOW TO COBBLE TOGETHER A COALITION AS WELL, SO WE'LL SEE
HOW THAT GOES. IT'S A VERY DIFFICULT JOB FOR

Gov. John Kasich: 'People Need To Have Health Care' | Morning Joe | MSNBC

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